There has *already* broken even for March and other updates…

We actually broken even last week – as of 03/25, we’d made $43,125 – wayyy past the break even point:

Subscriptions: $13,350
TB Sales: $29,775
Gross Income: $43,125

Excellent! Let’s keep it up!

(No, this does not mean we’re going to be reducing prices, making There free, including Therebucks with membership, or anything like that. On top of that little start-up debt, we’d like to build a little cash cushion for leaner times, or even to hire some help later on).


Some people have had questions about when “we” take the money out of their account. We (There) have no control over when PayPal will take the money out of your account. Generally, it’s about 30 days after you subscribed, but it sounds like PayPal may take the money a little sooner or later than that, for reasons beyond our understanding.


After talking about it a bit, SamSyn and I agreed that it makes more sense to get There open for new registrations before we resurrect the submissions system. The reasons for this are:

  • It’s going to take much longer to resurrect the submissions system than to get There open for new members.
  • There’s are tens of thousands of approved developer items which have already been recovered and are available to re-list, so there’s plenty of inventory for them to buy.

We’ll keep you posted as to our progress here.

By the way, by “new members”, we mean “new, unbanned members”. If you’re banned and register a new Avatar, we’ll catch you, and your ban will become permanent.


We’ve gotten some more mails from people who feel that they’ve “lost” items after we’ve migrated their possessions.

In 100% of the cases, we’ve found that the “missing” items were sold, given away, or turned out to be expired Try-Its.

Sometimes, it takes SamSyn hours to research these issues, time which he could be spending doing other things, like resurrecting submissions, opening There for new members, etc, etc.

We’ve also found that if you have thousands of items in the “root” of the “My Gear” or “My Things” (e.g., you don’t have any folders) it can’t take quite a while for the items to show up.

As a reminder from the invitation email, the following items will NOT be migrated:

Custom Cars will have reverted to their stock paintjobs and parts
Theredocs/QuestKits will be ’empty’
Some ‘interactable’ objects are unavailable
we no longer support “voozoos”
The Coke Music Mixer is no longer supported
Items received as ‘skill rewards’ are not migrated. instead, the skill system grants you new ‘golden tickets’

With those exceptions, we haven’t lost an item yet. So, please, before you fire off hate mail (and some of them have been … less than courteous..) consider that you might have given away/sold/etc your missing items before we closed.

Of course, it you have thought carefully and still think you’ve lost some items, write us at . But keep in mind our budget for handling these issues is $0/month.


Finally, I did some work on the OSX Version for OSX Lion this weekend. Unfortunately, while OSX Lion upgraded OpenGL, it also removed QuickDraw (Which we used), required a Qt (the software we use for the UI) upgrade, and a MySQL upgrade. Ick.

That’s all for now.

P.S. I’ll have to dig up a picture for this post later :-).

  1. #1 by alan4984 on 2012.04.04 - 6:00 am

    How can i get my age verified quickly? I send my ID to and have waited for almost 3 weeks.. so please someone help me since i paid for my monthly membership. avatar name: alan4984

  2. #2 by alan4984 on 2012.04.04 - 5:46 am

    Does anyone knows, how can i accelerate the process to get my age verified? I have waited for almost 3 weeks, i paid for my monthly subscription. So please help!! My avatar name: alan4984

  3. #3 by JS Avatar Enthusiast on 2012.04.03 - 6:04 pm

    I would like to join but not sure about this PayPal deal where they charge you 30 days after you sign up? Maybe I read it wrong but that sounds strange. I want to be charged the second I sign up. Also because I am planning on getting one avatar that has all my things one month and just a couple days before the end of the month get a new avatar then give all my things to the new one. Then shut down the original avatar. But with this PayPal fear-mongering I am not sure I can accomplish my goal. Who knows what will happen? Not have the capability to shut down before I am charged again for my avatar I am shutting down? I will have to think about this one. I doubt if anyone will give me any answers on this.

    • #4 by Michael Wilson on 2012.04.03 - 6:43 pm

      We charge you $10 when you subscribe.

      When you cancel, you will be able to log in until your subscription runs out – usually about 30 days after you subscribed.

      If you don’t cancel, PayPal charges you 30 days after you subscribed, and you get 30 more days of play.

  4. #5 by 1969Craven on 2012.04.03 - 2:23 pm

    Even though the submission program will not be up for a while .. Is is possible to put the old one up for download so I could get a jump start on designing? or is it currently available somewhere online that I am just missing… I miss designing buggies, I have some great new ideas and really want to get started.. Without the design program and ways to make money .. the whole thing is a little pointless to me. and the social environment is all but a ghost town. I miss picking on… I mean helping noobs.. Glad to hear that there may be some new blood coming in.. Keep up the good work. I just want to see it back and running 100% and not the 50% that we are at.

  5. #6 by Sandy Wager on 2012.04.02 - 2:51 am

    I look forward to seeing new members again. They will bring in more revenue and new ideas for events that we are so lacking at the moment but I also agree that the developers tools should be available. I for one, would love to try my hand at designing, something that I have tried but not mastered yet, and have a friend who wants to help me get my art into our world at a later date. If any of you are bored try one of my quests! I am so busy making quests but will help others to make quests too. It is massive fun and a great way to teach new people about the wonderful places in our world. Mail or IM me if you want to quest. Prize Tbucks too πŸ™‚ Quest Solvers For Tbucks Group. bikerbich (BB) x

  6. #7 by Justine A (@JustineA90) on 2012.04.02 - 1:18 am

    I m glad to see the update… and glad to see Mac OSX on your to do list. Thanks!

  7. #8 by alan4984 on 2012.03.31 - 6:00 pm

    I’M sorry for bothering a lot, just want to know why you’ll guys taking to long to verified my age? my avatar name is: alan4984..

  8. #9 by Biggiedude420 on 2012.03.31 - 5:24 am

    Hey Guys This is just a quick general question Im not keen still on Paypal and was wondering if perhaps could be available eventually to canadians as it is a legal way to purchase and would save so much hassle just log into you’re bank account and VOILA There is paid lol

    Miss everyone

  9. #10 by Michael Wilson on 2012.03.29 - 10:48 pm


    Please read the other blog entries, people’s responses, and the discussion on on our position on this.

  10. #11 by Mark B. on 2012.03.29 - 10:43 am

    I had a question… not sure how to address it but here goes.

    Will there be any kind of approval process for NH owners? The reason I ask this is because before There closed I knew several people that were part of a neighborhood that had its owner take off and pocket T bux that were then cashed out through a 3rd party. He never came back.

    Now I log in just the other day, and BAM! There he is… not sure where he was… but I just want to prevent someone from having to go through the same thing my friends did.

  11. #12 by BigD26 on 2012.03.28 - 11:08 pm

    Great to see things moving along as thay should, but a shock at first when seeing the title lol had me going tho lol
    Great that new members will soon have the chance to try out there.coms delights ‘tu, i guess i will have to sit quiet and wait for submissions to open but thats not a problem…
    However what are the chances of having the preveiwer to download so we can get things lined up ready? I dont need to be the upto date one, just something we can use to view the painted model in so we know where to make if any the changes to our designs.

  12. #13 by soledadnegativa on 2012.03.28 - 4:12 pm

    Thanks for the update, and don’t skip Physical Theraphy. You will regret it later.

  13. #14 by 12mandy on 2012.03.28 - 4:04 pm

    thanks michael for update and wonderful news thats its opening to new members thanks again,mandy

  14. #15 by ImageMaker on 2012.03.28 - 3:59 pm

    Speaking of in-world events, Alisah, myself, and (supplementing Thoreau, who has work commitments that won’t let him host on a regular basis) McKensy are working on bringing back the Flying Low GPSD race series that ran for three years before There closed. Flying Low is head-to-head, simultaneous start, out of zone races, using BtSt’s GPSD (back in full operation). With RabidBeast and PrincessPebbie not seen in a long time, there’s every chance for ordinary folks to win — three prizes in each of two classes (buggies, and bikes/boards). Check my profile to join the club so you get notified when the first race since closing is ready, and expect to see monthly races following on.

    And yes, new members can race — even if new members no longer receive hoverboards when they spawn (hopefully they will), there are plenty of folks willing to lend a vehicle. I personally have four or five buggies I never drive and half a dozen bikes and boards, and I’m a low-clutter sort in There.

    • #16 by Love2danceOn2 on 2012.03.29 - 5:53 pm

      I am very interested in learning more and joining.

      • #17 by ImageMaker on 2012.03.30 - 2:10 am

        Please do join the group then — my avatar name is the same as the one I use here; look up my profile from There Central or the People menu and join the Flying Low club. That way, you’ll get the invitations. We’re hoping to have our first race since closing in the next few weeks (need to have an organizer’s meeting to set the date, etc.), then one a month.

  15. #18 by SilverFang on 2012.03.28 - 12:23 pm

    I’ve been following these There updates through the blog and Thumdar and am excited to hear such great news. Looking forward to becoming one of There’s newest members.

  16. #19 by Mercuria on 2012.03.28 - 11:59 am

    I think it’s a great idea to get new members signed up as soon as possible.

    I hope that happens soon and I hope that getting the dev program up and running for submissions again goes smoothly.

    Thanks for the update! πŸ™‚

  17. #20 by SaltySilver on 2012.03.28 - 11:32 am

    Good news! Thanks, but how’s is your arm?

  18. #21 by SaltySilver on 2012.03.28 - 11:31 am

    Great news! Thanks, But how’s your arm doing?

  19. #22 by SunnyMusic on 2012.03.28 - 8:50 am

    YAY! Great Update! So looking forward to welcoming new members! And am sooooo happy about the financial news. Team Phoenix rocks!

  20. #23 by Jordan on 2012.03.28 - 7:53 am

    I’m really glad that everything is moving along good. Hey, I’m going to be on of those new members πŸ˜› going to have quite a bit of exploring to do!

  21. #24 by shanghei on 2012.03.28 - 7:07 am

    yeah, way to give Therians a panic attack dude… sheesh….. (yeah, ok, it was a good one) ‘tu ‘clap ”’yay i still turn around in circles in world and think.. “wow !!!! i’m home !!!! ”
    thanks for the continued hard work team phoenix, and to all my fellow Therians … WOOT !!!!

  22. #25 by Arbata on 2012.03.28 - 6:54 am

    This is great news! Now we can get tennants into the hoods… And welcoming new comers as they enter. YAY!

  23. #26 by afkisok on 2012.03.28 - 6:41 am

    Do Racing Buggies revert to their stock version, or is that just for in-world transportation vehicles?

    • #27 by ImageMaker on 2012.03.29 - 2:18 am

      As far as I’m aware, reversion to “stock” configuration only applies to the customizable cars (“Muscle Car” and other models tha allow after-purchase paint job, “engine”, and wheel upgrades) that appeared the last year or two before closing. Racing generally requires using a “standard” buggy (custom paint, but built on a preconfigured, There-supplied model) so everyone is playing on a level field; those buggies have retained their paint jobs and will handle the same way they always have (and I’ve got a lot of kilometers on my Solid Pine Buggy since getting back into There; the only change I’ve noticed appears to be due to my recent video upgrade, which increased my frame rate and made it easier to keep my buggy upright on rough terrain).

      FWIW, Flying Low races don’t limit you to standard buggies — different terrain gives advantage to different buggy types, and part of the challenge is choosing the right chassis for the course (without having seen more than the starting point). Drive a TUV, Monster Truck, Groovy Buggy, Muscle Car — whatever floats your boat.

      • #28 by afkisok on 2012.04.06 - 7:55 am

        Thanks for the thorough reply ImageMaker!

  24. #29 by lee_adama on 2012.03.28 - 6:21 am

    i’ve not been able to resurrect my legacy avatar at all it’s very frustrating

    • #30 by DDGQ on 2012.03.31 - 6:51 am

      Can’t be helped unless you go into detail, can it?

  25. #31 by Christy Clendenen on 2012.03.28 - 6:19 am

    Along the lines of what Francis7 said…. WHEW! You kinda scared me there for a minute. I hear the I’M bored thing a great deal, I have been guilty, what has happened with my own little Therian social group is a few key people are not coming back, some friends who were dating other friends broke up and everyone has scattered, so the THERE.COM dynamic that we all left 2 years ago has totally changed for us , but we are adapting and….. wait for it….. Meeting NEW people and have NEW experiences! I have really been enjoying making new friends, when you hang with the same bunch of awesome people for so long you forget to go out in the world and meet more, so I think everyone in our group is really looking forward to having NEW people in the game. I also know for me that a lot of things that I took for granted game wise, I don’t anymore, I have seen all the hard work and what’s kinda behind the curtain ( A charming turbo geek with a broken arm) and I think I take a little more responsibility and care a whole lot more about welcoming the newbies and going out of my ( our) way to be friendly and get them to stay in so we can all stay. The newbies are our future : P

  26. #32 by Francis_7 on 2012.03.28 - 6:01 am

    I think my heart missed a few beats when I saw the subject line “There won’t break even at the end of March…” In my in box today! Reminded me of that bit when Regan thought he was doing a microphone check and he ended up telling the Russians the’ bombs would start falling in five minutes’ by mistake! Glad it turned out to be good news in the next sentence.

    I think I have now recovered. Opening the world is probably the key to continued success, however I also fear the ‘I’m bored’ factor which seemed to plague new members even when memberships were free. With older paying members joining perhaps that will not be such a problem. Then again I do recall my first day in in 2003 (almost 9 years ago now) one of the first chat circle I got sucked into were a bunch of PB1 and PB2 avatars standing around saying how bored they were. While I do not understand the concept of being bored in there myself, I do see how lack of new developer items, even with tens of thousands to choose from, can lead to boredom.

    I am trying to imagine how long that period would be. I am guessing people would get bored with no new content after or during the second month. There are a lot of factors in this, way too many to even get my head around it. You have new members who do not know new content is coming who might stay happy, or they might interact with a developer or older members who may mention about the various new items that used to come out. How will they react? Will they unsubscribe and come back later? Will they continue to pay? How will included voice chat factor into retention? There does not revolve around the developer program, but it is a fairly large part of keeping There fresh and exciting, or at least occupied.

    There has a few technical issues currently that might cause new subscribers to think twice about renewing as well. The first hoverboat flotilla that BABS hosted was pretty much a disaster with people seeing boats sitting on the ground in one sector when they were actually flying away in a different sector.

    Until submissions are resurrected, cool in world events probably are they key to keeping these new members from being bored.

    Coolnet has been helping to form a community of members who like planning themed events:

    Therian Themed Events

    I sure hope this link works out…

    Currently we meet each week on Tuesday evenings to talk about organizing and planning a variety of fun themed events. I think this is a great way to help with member retention when There opens and beyond! I urge you all to join and attend and help us think up new and exciting events.

    Yes, it does sound like a commercial. Sorry bout that Chief, but I am still trying to calm down after reading that headline :0

    • #33 by Michael Wilson on 2012.03.28 - 6:05 am

      Did you report the Flotilla issue to SamSyn? We have a small staff, so it’s going to be hard to get a Flotilla together to reproduce it in-house πŸ™‚

      • #34 by Francis_7 on 2012.03.28 - 3:00 pm

        I do not think I reported the problem in writing. Sorry about that. I am pretty sure Samsyn was riding on one of the boats with us that night. There was a staff member there. I wonder if he left before the problems started. I shot a bunch of video, but then did not do anything with it as I had the checkbox to record my own voice turned off.

  27. #35 by Kevin Hammett (Kevman95) on 2012.03.28 - 5:42 am

    Great update! keep up the good work

    Hopefully i can come back aswell!

  28. #36 by margaret on 2012.03.28 - 5:01 am

    I’m trying to run There in a Windows XP image on VMWare Fusion on my Mac (Lion). Everything runs fine, except I can’t see my avatar. Is this related to the OpenGL issues you noted in this blog entry?

    • #37 by Michael Wilson on 2012.03.28 - 5:23 am

      No. I run it under Parallels on Lion just fine.

    • #38 by Jonathan on 2012.03.28 - 8:14 am

      I have the same issue, and exact same setup. If i use DX8 on the VM, it doesn’t show my avatar, but simply the drink I’m holding. Swapping to OpenGL seems to fix the issue.

  29. #39 by Frill on 2012.03.28 - 3:36 am

    Although I’m ready to get back to designing, I would much rather the focus be on new members.

  30. #40 by mimi06 on 2012.03.28 - 3:34 am

    Nice update! Makes me smile. I been so busy in world, I forget to come here.. lol. Thank YOU for this update and thanks to the crew for all the hard work involved!

  31. #41 by Wendy Stoll (Wendy50s) on 2012.03.28 - 2:27 am

    All I can say is YAAAAAAAAY!!!! And have you recovered? Make sure you take care of yourself first πŸ™‚

  32. #42 by Kattwomann on 2012.03.28 - 2:23 am

    I’m really curious how much There took in through developer sales.

    I’m even more curious how much There has made off my submission sales since I’ve been designing, but I won’t hold my breath on that one! :p


  33. #43 by Alease on 2012.03.28 - 1:00 am

    Thanks for update and for hard work!!

  34. #44 by lionsheart on 2012.03.27 - 11:47 pm

    Any chance of making the dev tools available for download so i can put my creative mind to use since i thought that was next on list.
    i know we wont be able to upload anything to get approved
    some feed back on the dev tools situation would be excellent.

  35. #45 by Phil Reinsmith on 2012.03.27 - 11:04 pm

    Thanks for the Great update, Any new on your Arm? How’s that going? Take Care of that.

  36. #46 by Babs There on 2012.03.27 - 8:21 pm

    ”’yay! ‘happydance

  37. #47 by Jennifer Taylor Waggoner on 2012.03.27 - 8:10 pm

    Keep up the good work! I know there r designers that are getting itchy….but all things that are GREAT are worth the wait πŸ™‚ I think most of the hood owners r ready for There to open to the GP. Tenants r slim for all the hoods out there . A lot of pple have opted for pazes. I know i have some family members that want to come into game so we can hang out. Most of my family live from OR to PA and MI to TX..we are all over the states. Maybe we can do a family reunion in world πŸ™‚ Thanks for the updates and do not work to hard…but hard enough πŸ˜›

  38. #48 by coolnet on 2012.03.27 - 7:24 pm

    Thank you for the update. Just out of curiosity, do you have a rough idea as to what the requirements will be for the Mac Users? What Mac version will it support? Also, Apple is coming out Mountain Lion this summer, will that be supported?

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